EP 2: A Pastor's Wisdom: Navigating Love in LA with Logan Lee

Welcome back to 'Let's Talk Relationships'! Today we're dropping the second episode with our special guest, Logan Lee, lead pastor of Ignite LA Church. Together, we delve deeper into the complexities of dating and relationships in Los Angeles, a city that's constantly in flux. In our engaging conversation, we explore how LA's transient lifestyle and diverse culture shape its unique dating scene. We share valuable insights into finding guidance and forming lasting connections in the midst of the city's ever-changing landscape. Join us as we uncover the secrets of navigating LA's intricate dating culture and building fulfilling, stable relationships in this vibrant metropolis

ABOUT Logan Lee: 

Logan Lee is the Lead Pastor of Ignite LA Church - A new church in the heart of the city of Los Angeles - that he planted in September 2022 along with his wife, Pastor Gabriella.

Originally from Omaha, Nebraska, Logan moved to SoCal in 2020, with a vision to launch a church that would Impact Los Angeles with the Gospel, Ignite a movement of the Holy Spirit, and Influence the Nations with the love of Jesus!

Logan attended Southeastern University in Lakeland, Florida, majoring in Journalism and minoring in Theology. He is passionate about seeing the local church living on mission, by reaching the lost for Jesus in a post-Christian, West Coast context.

Links:

https://www.instagram.com/loganlee.la/

https://ignitelachurch.org

Show Notes:
Calling in the One - Katherine Woodward Thomas
Meaning of Marriage - Tim Keller

Instagram:@letstalkrelationships_
Website: https://www.theltrpodcast.com/

Transcript

 I'm Beatrice, your host of the Let's Talk Relationships podcast. Join me and my guests as we explore all things related to singleness, dating, and relationships. Together, we'll hear from real everyday people and a few professionals and their experiences with self growth, heartbreak, modern day dating, and so much more.

Thanks for tuning in. And if you're here for the long haul, be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode.

Welcome to Let's Talk Relationships. You may not know this but this is our first episode that we are recording It may not be the first one we launch with but it is the first one we're recording And so we're going to just put it out there I've got my good friend logan lee here with me. He is the lead pastor of ignite la church Which is a new church with six months.

It's just been around. Uh Him and his wife came, moved to LA from Nebraska, um, Omaha, Nebraska and planted Ignite LA here. And, um, we actually met really random. We met on Facebook in 2020. I think it was 2020 or 2021. And, um, I forgot what we were even chatting, but it was like some group chat in Playa Vista.

And we ended up meeting cause I was like, what the heck? We live local. You're a pastor. Like I'm Christian. Like, let's totally meet up. Him and his wife and I, we, um, we had lunch. It was, it was so fun. We're just talking about like. Life in LA and what I loved about the both of them is they have such a passion for LA And I mean more than probably people that live here like they love this city so much So i'm so grateful that is able to come on this and just to see how much their church is already, you know Growing and and it's incredible.

It's not an easy thing to do. So I really commend you For starting in such a very difficult city. So, um But yeah, I think what we're gonna start with I'd love to kind of get logan's input on Life in LA and dating in LA. Like obviously he's married, so he's going to come from a different perspective on this, but, um, we taught, we've talked a ton about this.

We like DM back and forth on like just dating horror stories or what he's, you know, what's he seeing in his church and people he's talked to cause he's. He's been, um, he's a great connector. The one thing I love about Logan is he is a great connector. He will go out and meet people and start talking to them and know their whole life story in like two minutes.

So, um, I always love that about you. Um, so I'm just, that's where we're going to go. I want to kind of get your perspective, especially coming from Omaha, Nebraska and seeing kind of the difference in LA life and then dating life and how that kind of shifts. And then we'll kind of go into kind of what that looks like.

You know, we're obviously Christian, what that looks like in the church and, and, um, and all that. So take it away, Logan, give us your input. Yeah. Hey Beatrice. I'm so glad to be here. It's fun. I'm excited to be a part of this podcast with you. So, yeah. Um, you know, it's interesting because we moved here, uh, you know, three years ago, this month, March, 2020, and obviously things were shut down, but as things slowly reopened, we connected more.

Go out and meet people and we were putting a team together to launch the church We both moved here march 2020. So that's funny. I love that going. That's right. That's right Yeah That's right. Yeah, so what a wild time but it's interesting because um as far as relationships go because I know that's what we're talking about i've noticed a couple different things and I'm kind of like a cultural anthropologist.

So the way I I approach things is I always try to like Learn like what's the story behind the story? What's the overarching narrative of what I see? So for example, um, when it comes to relationships and people, one thing I've noticed is just how the pace of life out here, it affects not just the work you do if you're an artist, a creator, if you're a a Silicon Beach entrepreneur, whatever you do, but it affects your spiritual life and it affects your relationship life, your dating life, your love life, all that kind of stuff.

And so just a couple of things. So as a, I was a young adult pastor back in the Midwest. And so what we noticed is, you know, even leading young adult ministry back there of 18 to maybe mid 20, 25, 26, I think the oldest person might've been almost 30, but what I noticed back then is that a lot of people, even at 21, 22, we're trying to get married, trying to couple up, trying to connect it.

I mean, even my wife and I, we've been married nine and a half years. We'll celebrate 10 years in August. But even when we were in young adult ministry, we met a decade ago. But even back then, a lot of people were trying to get connected. Nobody wanted to be single past 30. That was what, nobody said that, but that was the sense, right?

And that's because the culture there, it just, it really puts a pressure on you to do that because of, I know we were talking earlier, there's really not a whole lot to do outside of work. Um, the social life is built around families with kids. It just is. And so, um, that's what you see a lot of. And so people are kind of conditioned to believe, oh, I have to do that because otherwise I'm going to be left behind.

Right? Finish my schooling. Finish my education. Get my degree. Find a spouse. Get married. Get a house. And all that stuff can be done because, you know, cost of living is different. All that kind of stuff. Yeah. Coming out here, for example, um, people don't come to LA to settle down. I always say even like people that are older, even people that are, you could be over 60, but you're not like old in the same way you'd be old in the Midwest.

Yeah. You know what I mean? Like you're still. You still have an energy. I don't even, I don't know how to describe it, but like nobody really grows old here. They're just, they're just still doing their thing. It's, it's amazing. No one does grow old here. It's actually true. Yeah. You know, they're doing yoga.

They're doing their, you know, they got their life going. They have a life. It's amazing. I love it. You know what I mean? Um, but what I noticed is in, in relationships out here and when we see it, like in our church, even to primarily people that are, we have a lot of people turning 27 this year and a lot of people turning 30, I would say our, our main demographic.

Is between, anywhere between maybe 25 and 35. Obviously we have a little bit older and a little bit younger, but that's like the main zone. A lot of it's singles and then couples who, you know, are engaged. Or married who don't have kids yet, that type of thing. And I'm noticing that the runaway is longer.

And so for example, people come here, like we have somebody, he came, he's the art director for USC's football program. His wife is a teacher at a school in Brentwood. Someone else is doing this. Like, people come for opportunity. they stay for opportunity. Um, and if, if they, if they meet people along the way, great.

If they have a family along the way, great, but they don't come here to get established. They come here to pursue and advance themselves in whatever field they're trying to, you know, grow in. And so you see in a relationship, people always think they can do better. People always think that, you know, it's greener, but people think that absolutely it's greener where you water it.

And so, but people think that they think, Oh, You know, I'll swipe left. I'll swipe right. I'll I'll filter this out. Like, it's such a thing in everything, you know, they think you can, they can curate their life. And I've never seen that before. I've lived in five states, um, from Nebraska, went to college in Florida, uh, came back, uh, lived in Idaho for a minute after school and now California.

And out of everywhere I've lived, like I love SoCal, but I've noticed that is such a culture here in L. A. And so you see that in relationships where people are always looking for something different. All right. They're never settled, um, and there doesn't really seem to be like a goal in mind, you know what I mean?

Like everyone's just trying to kind of make themselves good, make themselves feel good, and pursue some type of fulfillment. Well, and I think so much of it is about the self. Like, I think that's what we've, and I think this is culturally, you know, maybe it's starting to, you know, Make its way in other areas.

But I think LA from moving here, I mean, I, I lived in Long Beach and Orange County, so it's not like I moved like outta state. But even, even just that small move, I noticed a big shift here. One, it feels like everything's about your looks and what you're presenting yourself to be. I think that's a huge one.

I've never been so aware of what I look like, like ever that Then I moved here and I'm like, am I wearing the right outfit? Like I'm going to the gym and like, is my, am I like, do I look good? Like, it's like it's the gym who caress. But it's like such a different culture in that sense and I love what you said about like people are there's kind of there's a Goal career wise but they're kind of aimless and every other aspect of life, you know Like there's not like, you know, and I think I think we're getting there I think I think there's a big shift from your 20s to your 30s I think as you get into your 30s, especially for women you're starting to be like Okay, I kind of need to get it together a little bit more, um, and you know, you're kind of, you're kind of coming into your own, and I think for men it's a little different, a little bit, sometimes it's a little bit older, um, but yeah, I think we're kind of segwaying into, into a time where we're, where we're just, we're so self focused, and I don't, I don't know if that's a good or bad thing, actually, it could be a good thing, but I think it's a bad thing in terms of building lasting, loving relationships, you know?

Yeah, absolutely, uh huh, absolutely, and so like, for example, what I would see is like, Um, in the Midwest, you'd have, uh, a 35 year old female. She's probably married. She has at least two kids. She's probably done having kids at that point. She doesn't want to have more children. Um, probably has a home.

Probably is kind of settled into life if, if she's, if she stays at home. If she works, whatever, you know, whatever they want to do. Um, that's like, people kind of have their rhythm by mid 30s of like, this is my life for the next however many 20 years or whatever. Versus out here, 35 could be anything. Like, there's no type of...

Like, I've, like, like, and this is not a dig on anybody at all, but like, I've seen so many different, like, lives. Like, 30 to 35 could be, I'm trying to finish college. Or I'm trying to get into this field. Or I'm living with, like, five roommates. Or I'm... You know, trying to write this script, or I'm trying to, you know, start this business, or get up this, you know, ladder, like, it could mean literally anything, and so even just trying to minister to people like that, um, it's just a different demographic, and so relationship wise, um, I could just say, I'm glad that I came here married, you know, I couldn't imagine, I couldn't imagine, um, I mean, I could imagine it, but it, it doesn't seem like it would be as fun, like, Wanting to be in a settled relationship and then also be able to pursue all these things because it's really hard to have your cake and eat it too, so to speak.

It is. And I think that's what we're finding is we're also seeing a whole shift in trend of people marrying a lot older also. Like, people aren't really getting married in their 20s in L. A. Like, it's actually kind of more unheard of when you, when I meet people and they're like, I'm 28 and, and we're married.

I'm like, when did you get married? Like, 25. I'm like, what? Like, that's just so, it's just so weird. Like, maze. For this area, at least, you know, it's so different, but, um, what do you feel like, like, how do you feel like from the church's perspective, like, how is the church contributing to that? Because I feel like that's something that I see, like, not like the church's responsibility, but how is the church contributing to people waiting a really long time to get married?

Like, are they building the community for people for that? But just curious how you see that. Yeah, I think for decades, the church here in North America, U. S. and Canada, um, we've primarily geared all of our ministry programs, all of the sermons we preach, all of our systems, everything we do, marketing, social media, branding, all that, it's all geared primarily towards, uh, towards families.

Um, you know, there's this, you know, now if you look at scripture, Jesus was single, Paul was single, uh, there's so many examples of people that, I mean, lifestyles could look completely different, like there's nothing in the Bible about that, that you have to be married or have children or that's not even, that's not even held higher singleness, but yet culturally speaking, we've made it that way over so many years here in the States.

And so what has happened is the church structure has gone along with the culture. And that might work in suburban places, that might work in even parts of Orange County, that might work in parts of San Diego, it works in the Bible Belt, it works in the Midwest. It doesn't work in the city of LA. It just doesn't work because, um, because of all the things I just said, like people are living different lifestyles.

And so when churches think about stability, um, you know, stability, spiritually stability, financially stability, other ways, they think, okay, we need people like the church I grew up in. Uh, a large, you know, Pentecostal church, been around 85 years, 2000 people, um, you know, there's families that have been in a church longer than I've been alive, like 40 plus years, like they raised their kids there, there's this couple in their 70s, they're like the grandma and grandpa to like people my age, and they have had the same small group meeting in their house for 32 years.

And I think they may have missed a few weeks here and there, but literally like, like, it's like, and that's a thing and you can see the, the, the, just the general is beautiful because there's generations of people that have grown up in the state and children that have grown up and it's amazing, but it out here, it doesn't work that way.

So I think that the church has kind of tried to make that one size fits all approach when it comes to that. And as a result, we've kind of left. Single people and even married couples that don't want to have kids, which is a small demographic, but there's people that have made choices like, I don't think I want to get married.

I don't think I want to have biological children. I think this is the life that I've chosen. And a lot of times it's a lot of leaders just don't know how to engage them. Because you're trained to think of. Stability is married with 2. 3 kids, you know what I mean? And we're, we're, we're changing now, obviously, like 2023, it's going to take, you know, some more time.

I think the benefit to being a new church is that, um, everything's, you know, we're building our systems as we go. We don't have to start from like 50 years ago. We're doing it now. And so what has happened is that we can look ahead and go, okay, here's who we have. Some of them are probably going to follow a traditional route, but many of them might not.

And as a result... How are we going to minister to them? And so I think that's the challenge for the church in this season Yeah, and I I feel like you know, obviously we're going to speak from like a church perspective But this isn't this is kind of for everybody, but I also feel like people are going into relationships and dating And they don't really know what they want.

They don't know what they're looking for. And they don't even know who they are. I think that's such a big thing that I see. And it's like, I think a big part is where, what we're lacking. And whether this is in church or in life, but I think we're also really lacking like elders. Like we're lacking people that like paving the way for us.

Like, I feel like it's kind of like the sad millennials. Like, I don't know about Gen Z, but for like millennials, I feel like. We just don't have that like we're kind of out here like trying to figure all this out on our own I'm, like, I don't know what a good marriage looks like Like I had a trail of bad ones all around me like You know and I think that that's a big a big part of why people are also taking a lot longer to get married and and be in relationships because I don't think we even know what we're looking for.

I don't know what we're looking for. I think We're dating very aimlessly. We're like, Oh, he's cute. Oh, he's got a good job. Yeah. That sounds great. You know? And I feel like we've kind of shifted our mindset of, of, of how we date. And I think that that's a, that's a big problem. I think that's a big core reason why we're also taking so long is one.

We don't know what we, who we are. We don't know. Who we are so we don't know what we want so then we don't really know what we're looking for So we're kind of just out there on dating apps swiping left and right and like, oh, he's cute Yeah, let's go on a date, but we're not asking the right questions.

We're not digging in deep We're not under you know We're not understanding what's good for us and we're also not staying convicted to the things that we really want I think in relationship So in terms of like the church, I feel like the church is also totally left Single people out to just fend for themselves, like if they're going to do a singles ministry, it's always awful.

Like, let's just, every church that has done it, it's been like, like, I went to a singles event that I was not expecting. I thought I was seeing like a speaker series and we, I dragged some girlfriends with me and we show up and we're waiting in line and they're like, okay, what color wristband do you want?

And I was like, excuse me. What are you, what do you mean? And it was like some, some sort of red light, green light, yellow light, speed, not even speed dating, thing, and I'm like, No! Like, we can't do this at church, this is like, not what single people need, this is like, It'd be great to meet people at church that way, but I was just so like, No.

No! You know, but I do feel like, There's a lack of that, I think there's a lack of like, elders, there's a lack of people like, Really guiding us into, into that, like, What are we looking for in a relationship? How are we, you know, like all that I just like there's there's such a lot So we're kind of there to fend for ourselves to figure it out and I think that's what I'm I keep noticing with a lot of friends and and you know Just the people around me and just the community and just seeing people even at our church Like it's you cannot beat you can't meet someone at church.

It's wild to me I think like I've been through church my whole life. I've dated one guy That went to my church, like once, you know, and it's just like, it's just crazy to think that people always say, well, if you're looking for a Christian guy, then like, why can't you find him at church? I'm like, yeah, that was my, that was my standard.

That was my cookie cutter answer. Like I said, for, for many years, I'd be like, show up to church, you pursue Jesus, they'll pursue Jesus, you'll meet on the journey together. Right. And from what I'm hearing, at least here in LA, that's not, doesn't seem to always be the case. Um, and again, it's, it's, it's cultural, and so, you're right, we have to come up with a more robust way to minister to people versus speed dating, um, or just talking about, you know, being celibate, waiting on the Lord, and, you know, it's just, it's, it's, it's like, I can't, I can't take another, like, don't have, like, okay, we get it, let's move on, you know, like, from that, from that, it's like the same.

And not that there's any, right, and it's not that that's, it's not that, that's wrong with that, but it's, but it's the fact that, That's not robust enough, it's not deep enough, it's not helpful on my everyday life, like, like, I'm not just trying to go hook up left and right, so that's not helping me. What's, what's gonna help me is like, what am I supposed to be doing, um, You know, who am I in Jesus?

Who are they? How can we grow and become more mature people? So I will say too like it's interesting because I think like let's talk about dating apps for a second I've never used one because I got married in 2013. I think I think tinder launched in late 2012 I think bumble launched in 2014 and I'm sure there's more obviously online dating's been around long as the Internet's been around He Harvey's been around for 25 years or whatever, but This idea, like, it used to be, like, you know, like, when I was pursuing my wife, like, I had to, like, go up to her and pursue her and make a, make a move and talk to her, like, I did do a little bit of Facebook stalking, it's not really a thing anymore, Jens, he doesn't know what that means, but the funny thing about it is, is that, um, there was no swiping, you know, it's not like Airbnb or Peerspace where I can filter out what I want, like, I couldn't do that, like, what I had was who was there.

Yeah. Yeah. So, so whoever who around you? Whoever was there, yeah. Was that's, that that was the, the, the, the pool so to speak of like, potential people that I could want to, like, if I wanted to pursue somebody, if I wanted get to know somebody better, that's who what was there, you know? Um, and obviously all those people wanted to couple up.

So we had, we had like four or five friends that got married within six to nine months of, of Olive. We all got married around like less than a year of each other. 'cause everybody was trying to couple up and I actually had one friend be like, Hey, don't. Behind, you know, like, um, because nobody wanted to be the token single person over 30 something.

And, you know, obviously that's not a thing out here. Token single person over 30? Yeah, well, yeah, well, out here you're not really, no one's really a token single over 30. Because it's just, it's actually common. Um, and so I think, yeah, I think you're right, there hasn't been a good example. We're, we're, we're a couple generations removed from actually seeing good, healthy families.

Even if you come from a good family, you just don't see, um, You know, healthy, stable relationships, and people don't tell you about their life. People don't invite you. When's the last time a couple, uh, has invited you to their house? Like, come, like, do life with my family. Come, come see how I talk to my husband, and how I treat my wife, and how I raise my kids, and, and what we do, and how we, how we have a fun relationship.

Nobody really does that, you know? And, um, we just finished the prenatal counseling of a tween. Go ahead. Oh, no, no. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. Oh, just saying, like, we, we actually had a couple that, they're 22, super young. They just got married. We just did their premarital counseling. And one of the things I'm trying to be really intentional about is bringing them into, like, how, what we're doing, um, just as couples.

Because I want them to be able to see, um, you know, things. So, like, 10 years from now, when they're, you know, kind of where we are, I want them to be able to, um, be able to model what they've seen in their life. I want to be able to model that for them, so they can know how to live right. Because you're right, that's missing in culture.

And it's missing in church. Yeah, absolutely. I think that's a that's a big component and I think a lot of us You know, not a lot of us, but our our parents marriages I don't know that a lot of us are like looking up to that, you know We love them bless them but you know, they weren't necessarily the examples that we need and I think that's I think that's a big part of like I know you and I talk a lot about this is like When we're looking, what are we looking for?

Like, what are our standards? What are our, obviously from, you know, for me, it's like, you gotta be Christian, but it's like, beyond that, like, what are, what are we looking for? You know? And, um, you know, we, we've talked a lot about, like, you know, compatibility versus suitability, suitability. I can never say that word.

Um, and what the difference is between those two. And we, you know, we've, we said a lot, like with compatibility, you can be compatible with a lot of different people. And I think that's, That also makes it confusing because you're like, okay, well, this guy seems great, you know, um, but I think when it comes to like, is this person suitable for you?

I think to get to that level, you have to really understand who you are and what you are looking for and not like he's got to be six foot tall and he's got to have this hair and all that. And I think that that isn't modeled enough for us. Like we don't see that in other people's relationships. We don't see it in other marriages of like You know, hey when we were dating like this is what kind of brought us together This is how god brought us together.

This was like the the big thing in our marriage, you know, um, and so we're kind of just out here like What am I looking for? You know, I think that's like a big a big part of it. But like, um, Yeah, I just i'd love to get your take on like, you know Suitability before versus compatibility and kind of how you see that play out in people's relationships As they're seeking relationships.

Right, right, for sure. So first of all, the definition of compatible actually is the ability to exist together without conflict. Okay, and obviously you're going to have conflict. You're going to have conflict in a relationship. It's going to happen. The thing you have to learn is how to have healthy conflict.

Um, but then suitability actually means what is right or appropriate for a particular person or place. Okay? And so I think when we talk about compatibility and suitability When I think compatibility, I think of You're on the app and you're, and you're, you're, you're toggling or you're swiping, right? And it's like, again, you're trying to, you're trying to curate a relationship before you mess with somebody.

Totally, like, oh, he likes to camp. Oh, he likes to hike. Or he has a dog. Like, you're looking at all these cutesy things like, oh, you know, and you think that's like gonna be it. Mm hmm. Yeah. And okay, great. You know, we have our standards. Like, has to be a non smoker. Oh, you know. Has to, you know, likes dogs, likes to go on long walks, likes to travel, you know, vegan, likes oat milk, whatever, you know, whatever it is, L.

A. But I think the most important thing about that is that's not that hard to do because you can be compatible with a lot of people, right? Interest, um, you know, so some of our pastors back, uh, back in the Midwest, they actually say like, you know, we don't actually have a lot in common, you know, other than Jesus and football, you know what I mean?

But our passion is really. Being on mission and leading people to Jesus together and doing ministry together. So when I think about suitability, I'll just talk about my story So I got married at 24. I'll be 34 in July and I remember at the time that You know, I had spent a few months in the Middle East.

I had traveled I had went to college I had done a bunch of different things and I was on a trajectory of a career that I was wanting to start you know at a young age, but I remember when I met my my now wife who was then Actually, before she was my girlfriend, I remember specifically in that moment thinking, Okay, I have an archetype of who I'm looking for in terms of looks and attractiveness and interest and things like that.

But I didn't fill in all, like, a bunch of other details. Like, I didn't even think, like, I love to hike, my wife hates hiking. Like, you know, like I, he loves like going to roller coasters. I hate roller coasters. I close my eyes and I hold on a white knuckle. It's so embarrassing. I really, I do not like theme parks, but I do it for her.

Right. But my point is, is like, there's, there's like, to me, those, those are compatibility things. Now there's a lot we actually share in common, um, and a lot of other interests that we do have in common. But I think that the high level thing for, for me and for us was. What is Jesus calling us to do? Who, who are we?

Yeah. People. Who, who am I? And I think even at a young age, I had a, enough of a sense of who I was. Like for example, I knew I wanted to live in a major city. I knew that I wanted to start something. I knew I wanted to do ministry. I didn't know it was going to be a church plant. Um, I didn't know exactly all the details, but I knew, and she, she also had a calling to, to do that as well, like as a communicator and as a leader and all this stuff.

And so. We knew that was going to be a part of our story. We just didn't have the details worked out. And so I think because we had that worked out, we knew, okay, we can go along this road and we'll just build the rest of it together. And I think the problem is now is it's amazing because people get married later.

The only problem with getting married later, because I'm, I'm not one of those pastors. Some leaders will be like the solutions of the problems in America today is. Get married young, have kids, have babies, and yeah, yeah, we're going to just populate the world for Jesus or whatever, you know, woohoo. I'm like, okay, that's kind of weird, but whatever.

Um, the thing is this, we understood that we could figure things out as we go. So you can build a life for somebody. You ever hear about those old couples? It's like the notebook. You get married, you have nothing. And they build things up together. I feel like we've lost that idea a little bit. Cause now it's like, especially like as, you know, years ago, a lot of women didn't work outside the home if you go back 60, 70 years.

So it was very much like, stay at home mom, he has the career, you know, but now that both people are pursuing whatever they want to pursue, nobody really wants to kind of come and intersect their life with anybody. Nobody's really willing to compromise in any way. Um, and I think the thing is, you have to make sure you don't cap somebody.

That's a whole other topic we can get into, because I see couples do that, and it's really sad. I never want to throw a cap over somebody. I never want to be the ceiling. Um, I want to be the floor to my wife's dreams and aspirations. And so, what I've noticed, though... Yeah, yeah, but that's a part of that story too because a lot of people feel like well if I get in this relationship They're gonna hold me back.

Well, no, they shouldn't they should actually be the gas on your fire, you know And that's really what they're holding you back That if they're holding you back and that's something you got a question. Is this person right for me, right? raced for me Exactly. I think that's where we get really mixed up.

It's like is this person graced for me? Is this person going to going to push me into my like my purpose? But if you don't know what that is to start, you don't know who to bring with you in that, you know, like, I feel like if you don't know where your compass is, what's your north, where are you going, even if it's a little bit hazy, but like you knew, like, I want to be in a big city, I know I want to like potentially church plant or start this business, like you kind of have somewhat of a direction, so it's a lot easier, I feel like, to understand, okay, well, who would I bring, who, who would be most suitable for that type of life?

Versus us trying to find someone and trying to squish them into this life that we really want and they're like, uh, and then, yeah, and then someone ends up having to sacrifice and sometimes it's sacrificing their passions. It's sacrificing their own purpose in life, you know, and I think that that's a big, that's where you see a lot of divorce, unfortunately.

Yeah. And you know, we were just talking about this the other night at a singles event we were at, but as we approach 10 years, which I can't believe it's been, it doesn't feel that long by the way. I see. What? As we, as we, as we, uh, as we approach that, it's like we started running this journey like, like, like a marathon or like an Ironman with other couples.

And I can think of off the top of my head at least four couples that got married in the same year frame we did that are no longer married. They sell off. Um, affairs, um, divorce, uh, just stuff that I never, and it was very hurtful because like we were close with some of them and we saw things happen that I never thought I'd see happen.

But a lot of it came down to these things we're talking about. They weren't aligned. Well, they were misaligned there, there wasn't dialogue. Yeah. They had, they had a lot in common. They had a, they were very compatible people, but at the end of the day Yep. When, when everything rose up to the top and they were unhappy with each other, it was because they lacked that level of suitability and we, and we saw it.

Yeah. I think looking back, I can see it now and I think that's one thing that obviously, along with, you know, just the presence of God has sustained us is just this sense of like, um, we're very suitable for each other. We're very suitable. Um, I think that we've had, we've grown more compatible. Um, but we always have been suitable, if that makes sense.

Yeah. Well, and I think our interests and all that change over time, so I feel like being suitable for someone, when it's God given, it's like, this is the person, and I don't, I go back and forth on like, is there the one, I don't know, I haven't like fully decided on how I feel about that, but I do feel like God can grace you for someone in particular, you know, and by grace you, I mean like, he's kind of made you be suitable for this person, you know?

Like, I think like, if, you know. Like let's say I want to start a church or something like that's my passion or I want to start a business or something It's like I have to be mindful of like, okay. Well, what? What kind of spouse would I be? Looking for, you know, in that, in that sort of space, you know, and I think, I think a big thing I see is people, yeah, they look at like, Oh, we like some of the same things and things like that, but like, that's not really going to sustain you.

You know, I'm reading this book right now and it's so good. It's called, I hate the title so much. I wish they could change it. It's called calling in the one because I hate sounds so cheesy. I almost didn't want to read the damn book because it's called calling in the one. But, um, I'm starting to read it.

And so it got to a, I think it was like chapter five. Talking about our purpose and she's really adamant about, I wish I had the author's name, but I don't, I'll put it in credits, but, um, she talks a lot about like really knowing your passion before you, I keep saying passion, I mean your purpose, really understanding what were you put on this earth to do, what is deep down inside of you that God has made you and created you to be, what is that thing, and it might not be always clear, but you have this inclination of what that is.

And I think that needs to be super clear before we really start pursuing anyone. I think before we start dating and you know, I think there's like that little bit of like discovery that we have to kind of go through, but I think when you kind of understand at the core, what that is and you understand, and then it goes into understanding yourself.

So that's a big one. So understanding who you are and understanding at the core, what your purpose is, but it really allows you to align like, okay, well, if that's the case, what do I need? What are, what are my needs in a relationship? What are the things that I'm really. Really looking for especially if I want to pursue this.

I feel like if god is calling me that to that Um, and what she had said she's like the marriages that tend to last the longest are the ones that have a shared purpose And I think that's so beautiful, and it's so real. I think Tim Keller talks a lot about this in his book, um, The Meaning of Marriage, about how marriage is way more than two individuals coming together, and now, woo, they get to make each other feel really good, and it's all great.

It's like so much more than that. I think the marriages that last long are the ones that find purpose in their marriage. Like, their marriage stands for more than just themselves. Their marriage is bigger than themselves. And I feel like that is, that is a lasting marriage. That is a marriage that will withstand things.

Cause it's not about your feelings. It's not about the circumstances. It's not about any of those things. It's truly understanding. Like we are a team and we have a bigger purpose than just you feeling good and me feeling good. And that's like, obviously that's part of it. That's, you know, but I just feel like a shared purpose and marriage is so beautiful.

And I think such a big thing that's missing out there when we are looking for spouses and we are dating, we're kind of. Not dating with that. We're not really dating with purpose and in mind, right? No. Yeah, and then people just aren't they're not thinking about Where they want to go. They're not thinking about who they are and what they want to build together Like why you're here?

Why are you here? And I think I think for me Um, I've always kind of had that kind of sense of calling. I've always kind of had this sense of purpose I grew up around a lot of people that You know like people like my youth pastor people like other leaders in my life like that was kind of drilled into me at a young age a Lot of people don't have that though And so a lot of people They go to school, like, what are you going to major in?

I don't know, you know, I'll just figure it out as I go. Yeah, you know, um, for me, it was always very intentional, but a lot of people, they, they kind of don't really know where they're going. Yes, a lot. And, and, and the thing that, that, that surprises me is, I think, here in LA, you see it like, it continues on for a much longer period of time.

And I think it's, there's not really a sense of urgency. Nobody's really telling you. Um, in culture, in the church, that you have to, like, I knew, for me, like, I knew, like, um, I actually had somebody tell me, by 25, I expect you to figure out this. Oh my gosh. And, uh, I don't know if I would tell someone that right now, but I, I think, for me, it was just kind of, again, like, cultural pressure.

Like, and I, I'm not into shaming people, but I do believe in pressure. I think pressure can be appropriate at times. I do think that, especially with men, um, men in this, in this environment, there needs to be some more pressure. In terms of who are you, what are you building, what are you trying to, you said it not me, just saying

Yeah. Yeah. And I, and I, and I think, and I think what you've said this before is like, if we're gonna make it like specific, like in in law in, in la um, it's this, the culture here is very much catered to the female demographic. Um, yeah. You know, out, out, I see a lot, every clothing pop up, every food thing, like whatever's going on, whatever.

I, it feels like everybody who's anybody. Who's doing something new and fresh and whatever they the vast majority 80 percent or more women and that's awesome And I'm very I'm very for that. My only concern is that Men are falling behind and they're falling behind in culture Again a whole nother conversation, but you see it in in academic stuff and whatever lovingly

Um, shepherd into care and to build alongside a, um, a woman. And so I think what happens is, is when we don't take that place, you end up with a lot of women that are highly competent, highly capable, but they're very dissatisfied and they're very frustrated. And it's not good for anybody. You know what I mean?

It's just not. It's just not. And, you know, and, and I think that's, that's, that's, that's creating problems longer term in, in culture. So yeah, again, purpose is what leads you and what guides you in, well, again, like not to be on like apps and things, but that's, no, in the whole era of swiping, that's, it makes it even, it lowers the bar so much to the point where you don't have to think about purpose.

It's so easy just to be like, Oh, what are they doing tonight? You know, and just, there you go. And I see, and I'm not, okay, I'm putting this out there. I'm not trying to bash men because I truly have a heart for men. And I love men in the sense of like, they're my brothers. I really do believe. That they have been left behind.

I really do. I really feel like they don't have great leaders that can pour into them, can show them, can teach them, can guide them, can give them wisdom in that. And said, they're left to kind of societal devices. Like they really are. And I see it. So I see it with my own friends, my guy friends. I just want to slap them sometimes.

Like you are too old, you've got to get it together, you know? And it's like, but I do feel like that, that's a big lack is like. You know, it goes back to marriages not having the examples But I think men also don't have other men to talk to to like deal with a lot of these issues to To dig in deep and you know, I think that's a big And I think that's where women we've kind of like surpassed men entirely.

I love this guy, um, Brian Reeves. I follow his work a lot. He, um, he does a lot of work specific to men and I started diving deep into his work because it just opened up my mind because I'd be so frustrated with guys I was dating and, and, you know, I'm like, Oh, why do they act like this? Why are they so immature?

Why aren't they, you know? And he has such a beautiful approach to men at just, you know, and I, it gave me a lot of compassion for men. He talks a lot about just how, you know, men have been taught, don't have feelings, shove it down, just suck it up. Don't, you know, and then over women here expecting them now to be compassionate, to be empathetic, to be loving, to be good leaders, to be, but like leaders who can be empathetic and like be soft, but mostly available and be emotionally available.

Like we're now requiring. So much of men, but I think if you really think about it, who's teaching them that? Yeah, like there aren't great men groups men don't get together like women will freaking have therapy sessions together But like men don't have that like men are not getting together and opening up and being vulnerable and talking through these issues They're either talking with their significant other which they should they should be talking to men about you know Like really being able to you know, you talk to your significant other but there's got to be a safe space For men to be able to communicate with each other and I think that is you know, I think that's a big I'm going to speak specifically to the church because that's kind of like where we're at here.

Um, but like, I think that's a big reason why there's so many single people in our church and our churches, like I really do. And I, I think women, we have been to death, like grow and do the, you know, like. Grow and learn about yourself and be better and all that like I feel like I've done so much work on myself I'm exhausted You know and it's like but it's like self worth proper 31 women and all this stuff so much.

I'm like girl your girls exhausted like she'd be waiting for her prize. Okay, like You know, but it's like but then it's like how am I gonna find that mash? obviously, I trust God that he's gonna bring that person but it's like Like that means men have a lot to live up to like they've got a lot of work to do and they're not doing it Is the problem and we're just seeing it in groves like they're just it's just not happening, you know And I think that's what's holding them back a lot of time from what they really desire They did I imagine a lot of them desire marriage and they want all that But then when they have it, they're like, I don't know what to do with it Like I don't I don't know what I want.

I don't know, you know, and I like you said I think there's not there's not a lot of pressure on men I To do that, like they can wait forever. They can be in their fifties and still be single. There's not pressure on their end. Whereas for women, we unfortunately do have a clock and we do feel that pressure a lot more, but I think that that's so accurate.

Like, I think the lack of pressure. Um, on men is, is a problem. And again, I'm not saying this cause I'm bashing them. I'm saying this because like things have to change. Like I think what women are now requiring in relationship, especially a mature relationship, um. Men just have to step up if they want to be, you know, equivalent to that and be able to lead that.

Like, if you, if you haven't done your own work, if you don't know who you are deep down, if you haven't dealt with some traumas from your childhood, if you don't know how to feel your feelings, all that, it's going to be very hard to find a quality woman who's going to put up with it. Right. Who's going to Right, because she's done all the, she's done all the inner work and all that stuff.

Yeah. Right. Yeah. And you're just out here. Yeah. Yeah. You're just out here like, I don't know. You know, and I think something interesting Brian Reeves said, it's like she's, he said a lot of men don't grow out of their adolescence until around 38 to 42, 38 to 42. That is crazy. And a lot of it is because they just, they get stuck with these.

These patterns from, from adolescence, and they don't really ever grow out of it. They just kind of get older, but they're still, you know, and a lot of them either are still single or in, you know, relationships that aren't very, you know, fulfilling, divorce, things like that. And, and, and again, women have a lot of work to do too, by all means, this is not to bash men, but I do feel like men just have been kind of forgotten in that sense.

Like, you know, I think there's a lot of work there that needs to be done, and it's, it's, um, I think it's contributing to why people are also aren't getting married earlier. Right. Yeah. And, and I see that even more here in LA than I did in other places because it's so female driven out here and I've I've noticed it.

Yeah. Um, to that point. And so it's, uh, and one thing that we've, we've, we've been doing now that we're, that we're working on as a new church is as we get everything established, even with our leadership team and everything is one thing I noticed that we noticed early on was. Without giving a lot of direction, the women would just kind of take ownership of things.

They would just start to lead. And, you know, and it didn't really require, like, you know, like, my wife, like, has, like, these leaders that she's portrayed, these ladies that she's connecting with and people will connect with. And, and they'll just, like, a little bit of just, like, you know, you go girl and just kind of like, like, helping them grow.

Yeah! But then they'll just, they'll run really far. But then... With the guys, like, as I'm connecting, I'm like, okay, this is gonna take a little bit more foundational type stuff. Absolutely. Even just basic things like, like I, you know, and I, I, I've never had someone, I had someone recently even tell me like, yeah, I don't really know if I'm a leader.

And I'm like, I, I know people say that, but like, I've never heard somebody say that to my face. I, you know what I mean? Like Yeah. In, in a way that's like, and I'm like, I don't, I'm like, I, I'm like, well, I'm not saying you have to start your own business or plant your own church, but I mean, You should be someone of influence.

You should be somebody that people would want to follow. Like, that's something that I've always aspired to. I can't control the, I can't always control the level of that influence. Yeah. Whether it's tens, hundreds, thousands, or millions of people. But, you know, I think we all can aspire to that. But just hearing people say things like that, I'm like, okay.

Other than somebody would say like, yeah, it's actually hard for me to motivate myself. I'm like, you know. If you're not self intrinsically motivated, it's really hard to get somebody motivated to grow spiritually. Hey, read your Bible. Hey, pray. Hey, um, be more engaged, take ownership, take leadership, take, you know, make, make, make effort to do something.

Um, you know, if you're interested in, in that girl, like stop just checking her out of church and go approach her, say something to her, right? You know, and so, and all these things. Yeah. Yeah. No, and I wonder if the disconnect there is because men, because they don't communicate with each other or even in a deep way, if there's a disconnect or they're, they're just disconnected from themselves.

So there's, so I feel like there's a, there's a point where I think men can be so disconnected from themselves because they can't feel their feelings. They just, so, they just outwardly like try to distract. And I wonder if that's why they're like, I don't know how I don't want I don't feel like I could be a leader You know in a you know, and maybe they're not a leader anywhere else But they're a leader maybe in you know a marriage or they're a leader in you know In their relationship, you know, I always wonder that though.

I think a lot of, I think there's a fear there because they think I can't, I'm not, I think a big thing, big fear for men is I'm not good enough. I'm never going to be good enough. Like those are kind of the reiterated fears. And so I wonder when someone, when a guy approaches you saying that, Hey, I don't know if I could be a leader.

I don't have motivation, but motivated to what? Like, I think. How can you have motivation if you don't have a goal? Again, if you don't have a North star, what's your purpose? You don't know yourself. So you're disconnected from who you are. So you don't know what God created you to do. So you have no purpose.

So how are you leading? Where are you leading? What are you leading? And how are you motivated to lead if you don't know where you're going? So I think it's like, it all goes back to like, I think, I think it all goes back to in our singleness, are we actually using our singleness to the, to the. Maximum like where we're using the opportunity when we're single to really figure out like who the hell am I God?

Who did you make me? Yeah, who'd you make me? What's my purpose? What are like, you know, like What am I on earth just reminded me of something? What yeah, and you just that's so so and I think that's actually the missing piece because I was asking myself this Even before I knew we were gonna do this. I'm like, I'm like, what is the difference because I know I'm not perfect But like for some reason even in my early 20s, I always I've always had this sense of yearning to want to do something significant with my life.

And where did it come from? I mean, obviously there's different things I went through as a child and, you know, grew up in a single parent home and a lot of things I had to do on my own. But I think, for me, I spent, um, a month and a half traveling the Middle East by myself. And I think, sleeping on the beach in Tel Aviv, learning Hebrew and Arabic, like, I think every guy, I took multiple road trips across, I've driven across all the United States from Florida to Washington three times.

And, you know, like nights in Montana by myself on the road. And I just think it's moments like that, that shape a lot in you. Um, and I think a lot of guys that I've met, it just went high school, college. They just kept doing what they were told they had to do. And then when no one, when people stopped telling them what to do, they didn't know what to do.

Yeah. And so, and so then when you get to a certain point, you're like, uh, I don't really know what I'm doing. I guess I just go to work and I just do my job. But. There was never any sense of like self reliance, like it's on you, like you're in the wilderness, build a fire, figure it out, you know? Okay, Lord, help me.

It's me and Jesus out here, right? Like I've had a lot of those me and Jesus moments in my life where I had to just figure it out. And I think there's a certain part of, not to sound like, you know, like Neanderthal, but I think there's a certain part of like being a man where you have to have moments where you have to figure it out.

And I think that the modern society. There's just, you don't have to do that, especially in a city. I'll just door dash it. I'll just take an Uber. You can't door dash your life, right? Like you got door dash and Tinder your life away to the point where like, you don't know what you're doing. Cause you've never been put in a position where you had to figure out what you should be doing.

Well, yeah, I think you're disconnected from yourself. So, so they tend to use distraction. They don't want to deal with it. They don't want to deal with internal anything. What am I, any, any of those questions. So instead they. They, they pour themselves out in, in all the distractions of the world. And so why...

I had an existential awakening at age 22. And so that changed my life. You know what I mean? Yeah. And I think if you, yeah. You have to have a moment where, you know, and it could be a come to Jesus moment, everyone can have a different moment, but it has to be a moment where, um, and I'm not talking about like following Jesus.

I'm talking about there has to be a moment where you actually go, okay, where, where am I going? Who am I and where do I want to go? Where do I feel like I'm being called to go? Because one thing you'll notice in life, um, is there's some things in your life that are just trying to happen, even if you're not making them happen.

You ever felt like you're being pulled in a direction? Right? Whether it's starting a podcast, or whether it's a job, or a relationship. Like, you feel like this is kind of where it's going. Obviously I have to do the work, but I feel like this is kind of where I'm being pulled in this direction. So I just keep saying...

Take a step, take a step, you know, and so, yeah, I think for single people, um, in particular men, but I think women as well, it's, it's, it's really taking that time to figure out who you are when, when the lights are off, you know, those dark nights of the soul, when you're all alone, like, who am I? If I had to spend the rest of my life by myself, if, if, if nobody told me to come into work tomorrow, if, if, if there was no accountability structure in my life whatsoever, who am I?

Yeah, I think that's, that's such, I think that's at the core of so much. And obviously beyond that, there's who am I, and then you have your traumas that you have to also work through in order to be in a relationship. But that's like, that's a different podcast. This is just more like, yeah, it's like really finding.

Yeah. Who am I in the dark? Who, and it's funny because I think for me, that moment came when I moved to San Diego, I felt that was definitely a God thing. I moved to San Diego for a job. I didn't know a soul. Nobody. Literally nobody. It was a really, really tough year. It was dating long distance, which was a terrible idea to do.

And I felt so alone. Like, I felt so alone in that year. But that is the year that I was like, there's something inside of me. Like, I still don't know what it is. Like, we're still figuring it out. But there I felt like, Oh, God's putting something on my heart. There's something inside of me and I have a lot to say.

But that was that was what, 2019? And we're in 2023 and I'm just now starting a podcast. You know, it doesn't always happen instantly, but it's like that was that moment. I think if I I really felt that God took me to San Diego for a purpose, because I was living in long beach before, and I had the best time.

I had like all the friends. I had all the activities, all the things I was, I was distracted though. I mean, I had, I had something every night of the week, my life now looks so different, but back then literally salsa dancing did every night of the week. I had something. So it's like, how am I going to discover who I am?

I had no idea. I was just wailing out, like having fun just every night of the week. And it was like, then God's like, Oh, you're going to go to San Diego. And I'm like, what, why? Like. The only job opening possible. Like I applied everywhere. The only place that offered me a job. I'm like, okay, I have no job. I got to go.

So I go and it was funny. I feel like that was like the wilderness for me. Like when you got talks about you going through the wilderness, that was the wilderness. I was like, I don't know a soul here. And I'm a social person. Like, you know, but it was, like I said, that was, that was the year. That kind of planted the seed for this podcast was that year was, you know, I was alone.

I started reading books. I was in a relationship that like, at the time I felt so alone and, and now I know, I know in retrospect, I know why, but, um, so it led me to like, I started reading books. I got into Brene Brown. I was reading Rachel Hollis back then. Like just started reading all this stuff and learning about like who I am and my issues and all of that.

And, you know. And that was instrumental into moving to LA because I think if I had moved from Long Beach straight to LA It would have been really tough because I think if you don't know who you are moving to the city it will It will rip you up apart. I really do believe that like I feel like you really have to come here and kind of Have a sense of who you are and what you're driven toward and all of that Because this place will influence you and not always in the best way I think it's influenced me in good ways like my health and my diet.

Am I working out? I'm all about it now, but um I I can see that like it can it can have you waver because it's so distracting So I I feel that strongly for like for a lot of single people like really taking this time You know, to really hone in and figure that out and really work on yourself because I think that's going to allow us to make better choices in who we're going to date.

So I think it's, it's, it comes to that, like who, who we're even saying yes to, you know? And I think that goes to men. Okay. How do I lead? How do I be motivated? Well, again, it goes back to, well, who are you? What are your, what's your purpose? You know, without, I think without going through that, it's going to be really hard to answer those questions.

You know? Yeah. And I think that we, we, we like to avoid pain. I'm reading this book right now called Leadership Pain, um, by Sam Chan. It's, it's such a great book about how in order to be a good leader, you need to raise your threshold of pain. Um, yeah, you do. Yeah, you do. Just like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, I think I did enough, but then I, you know, I planned a church and this happened.

I'm like, okay, I got to raise that pain threshold just again and again and again. But you have those moments where you're like, I don't think I can do this anymore. Like, I wonder if I could just quit and go back to what I used to do, you know? Oh, I thought about that last week! I was like, oh my god, I can't Like, I know Joke last week was like, Can I just, like, work at a restaurant?

Like, I'm I don't All I don't want to do all Like, I was like, This is too much. Life is too much. I was like, ready to quit everything. Can I just clock in and clock out and just go home? Exactly, yeah. Exactly. My life was so much simpler. So much This whole trying to find my purpose, I'm like, Um, let's just I'll just work at a restaurant, Be a bartender, be fine.

Yeah, usually, right? And I think, um, like you said about the city, people, when people come to a city like this, very young, Um, it influences you, often negatively, because you don't have a sense of who you are. And that's why I said, like, I think it's, you know, I came here a little bit older, so I think it's better.

Um, but I, I think, I think a lot of people come, you know, and it messes them up and all that stuff, which puts them back even further. But yeah, I think all that coming together, we, we try to avoid pain. We try to avoid that learning, that growth. And it bleeds into relationships. And so, you're right, people are, are, they're dating aimlessly.

They're going aimlessly. And then, another thing to that too is like, just, this, this, this culture of just, um, I've never seen like, there's, everything's an event. Everything's an event. Like, I'm the event planner and I'm like, yeah. Yeah. But it, but it is, I mean, like, like, like church, like we would back, you know, before like we would have events and stuff, but like treating every Sunday, like it's its own event.

Like, but it's a thing. Like you're constantly like, it's, it's like, like before I'd be like, Oh yeah, young adults hang out. We're going to do this and me, we'll go bowling or we'll have that, you know, come hang out, maybe we'll make a post on Instagram and then, you know, it'll get likes and whatever, you know, but now it's like, no, Sunday, you got to promote it.

You know what I mean? Um, and, and there's this sense I've noticed here and you can tell me if this is true, maybe it's my perception. It's this sense of like. People expect you to promote things and if you don't promote them to a certain point they go it must not be that dope if it's not promoted I guess I just won't come.

You know and I'm like. Everything in LA is about perception. Like and I, I obviously I work in marketing and I just like that's what it is. Everything in LA is so much about perception. Oh was it promoted well? Then I'll go. Oh was it on the, then I'll go. Oh did so and so tag it? Then I'll go, you know? It's like such a, ugh.

So I, anyway, I, I figured that all out and I, you know, I, the almighty algorithm, I know it all now, but, um, the interesting thing about it is, again, that bleeds into everything else that we do. And so, um, that influences relationships when it shouldn't, you know, because people are, it's like, you're, you're, you're more in love with the idea of something you're not understanding.

Um, there's something called confirmation bias where. What one person thinks this person's attractive and so I think they're attractive or this person thinks this is that and it's like, well, what do you think? Like, yeah, for yourself, form your own opinion about this individual about this thing. But yeah, and life moves so fast that nobody's slowing down enough to think through what they're looking for.

No. And then that's why we stay in relationships long that are not good for us. I mean, and there's also trauma things that for that reason, but this is just, we're just generalizing for everyone listening for the two people that are listening. Um, it's just generalizing, but we do, I think we fantasize. You know, we're more in love with the idea of being with someone and the idea of a relationship than we are of what actually a relationship will call us to be and will call from us, like what, what, what it requires of us.

I think that's another thing is we, we get really stuck on. I want to be in a relationship. I want to be all that. But then what we don't ask is like, well, what do I need to be to be in a healthy relationship? Like, where's my responsibility in that area? And it goes back to, again, you don't want to feel pain.

We don't want to take the responsibility for ourselves. We don't want to take the responsibility of finding what we want. We just, you know, and that's a big thing too. It's like not taking, you know, because I think a big part of it is we get frustrated. Like it goes back to this book I'm reading, Calling in the One.

Um, but I love it because she makes us, She really, the way she writes it, it's very much like you gotta take responsibility for yourself. So like, you're in a bad relationship or you're in a relationship you're not fulfilled in. Have you communicated your needs? Have you done all this? And if you have and this person cannot meet them, well guess what?

That is your cue to walk away and to move on. Instead, we stay and we're like, but this is so annoying and why aren't they like that? And da da da da da. And I'm guilty. I have done that many a times. But you know, it's really You can't change people. You And it's like really taking the responsibility on for ourselves and I think that's it just goes back to like kind of everything we're saying.

It's like I go back and forth because it's like this whole everything's about self and it kind of is like Because I think we've got we come to a society where we have like avoided self so much you know a true self like deep down who did God make you to be that like It is coming back to that. Like it's coming back to like, who am I as a core person?

Because I think the problem is in our society now, as we have so much influence around us that will tell us who we should be, what we should wear, what we should like, what we should look like, how our hair should be. Every little thing around us is constantly grabbing our attention to tell us who we are and who we should be.

And it's like, that's going to affect us because I feel like, are we just putting on a shell of a human of who we think everyone wants us to be? And then we're dating from that place. So we're not even dating from an authentic of who we are place. We're dating from a shell of a place that has been built by society telling us what we look like and all the things.

And then we're in these relationships longterm and then maybe we wake up one day and realize who we really are. And then we're looking at the person we're dating, maybe even married to. And we're like, Oh, oh, I would have never picked you had I done the work on myself and had I actually understood who I was at the core.

Yeah, and so what happens is relationships, it's like, yeah, who does Equinox want me to be with? Or be like,

you know, look at the time. But I think it's interesting because you're right. People will get in relationships and relationships become almost like an aesthetic. Yes, it fits their life. Like an accessory. It's so interesting to me. Here's my boyfriend. He fits perfectly into my world. He dresses like me. He fits in with my Chanel bag, and he fits in with my, you know, whatever else.

And you're right, it's a whole thing. Um, and you're right. I love all these personality things, like the Enneagram, and there's disk assessments, and there's, you know, and I've used tools like that. But that doesn't even tell you who you are. No! That doesn't tell you who you are at the core. So, I've used things like that after I've already done that determination of who I am.

And even when we talk about, like, introversion, extroversion, people don't really understand. That doesn't really define who you are either. No. You know. So, again, so yeah, if you don't know who you are at the core, like, who is Logan? Who am I? Yeah. Who am I by my... Who am I? By yourself. And I think that's the, like, I can hear the question people ask me.

Well, how do I figure that out? Well, what do I do? Well, how do I know? And I think a big thing is spending time with yourself. Like, not just... Yeah, like, not distracting. Not trying to just go on to the next thing, go to the next event, plan the next trip, go to the next party, good, like, that's all I did in my 20s, I was like, my career, this, next, constantly, like, I didn't have a break, and when I finally had a break, I was like, oh, you start to see yourself a lot more, you know, and you drop the defenses, you know, I think a lot of it is, Knowing how to spend time with yourself if your thoughts with your feelings with all of that and really getting at like asking yourself like do I actually really like this or am I just liking this because Everyone's telling me to like this, you know, I think it's a lot of time spent alone.

At least, that's what I think. I think that's a starting point. Then there's therapy and all the other things. I think the starting point is can I spend time with myself? Right, and so when we sit down with couples or single people like in a church setting and I'll be kind of counseling somebody through like a life situation.

Um, I'll do this thing where I'll try to bring them back to like what I call first principles. Like, just take a step back and just critically think about this situation right now. You know, like, like, Someone's like having an issue with their roommate, or they're trying to, they're praying about their job, or about going to go back to school, or about a relationship, and it's like, again, like, you're moving so fast that you're not thinking about what you really need.

Mm hmm. You know, and you see it, like, you're hopping churches, you're hopping jobs, you're moving around all, you're doing all these things. We're doing. We're in a culture of doing. Yeah. That's all we know. Exactly. We don't know how to Just take a break. Like, God right now in my life has been telling me to wait.

Wait on him. Wait. And I'm like, so I just want to do anything? He's like, no. I want you to wait. And hold on. And I'm like, this is... Are you sure? I'm like, Yeah. Wait on the horse. You don't want me to do anything? And he's like, no. Like, I have something for you. And you have, it's like, The next opportunity is going to come, but you have to wait.

It's not ready. And I'm like, It's so counter cultural. And it's the same thing with like, discovering parts of yourself. It's the quieting down. It's the not doing. Yeah, there's a verse in song. Oh, go ahead, go ahead. No, it's um, you know, as I'm, as I'm, Um, in, in the book of Psalms, um, King David is talking about, and he says, You know, I, I've calmed and quieted my soul.

Before the Lord. Um, and that's something that I, I do, I try to do every day, every morning, I try to do it throughout the day. And just have those moments where I'm, Especially now that I'm doing a song, I'm doing a lot of things. I'm involved in a lot of things, a lot of events and different, you know, um, you know, things that are both internal and external, but taking those times to just stop and quiet my soul and my mind and just not even like think, I don't even think I just, I'll just, I'll just sit sometimes, you know, just take some time, take 15, 20 minutes and just kind of sit and just listen for the voice of the Holy Spirit in my life.

Um, and, and God will talk to you. You really will. And so, yeah, I think a lot of these things. You know, from a faith perspective, it's hard to act, to access this kind of stuff if you're depending on your belief system. But I think if you're, if you're somebody who really does follow Jesus, if that's number one in your life, you really need to take that time to step back, to calm and quiet your mind and quiet your soul and quiet your heart and really focus and process, um, what God's speaking to you in the moment.

Yeah. And for those who are, you know, who are listening who may not be Christian, may not follow Jesus, I think a big part of it is, It's just slowing down and quieting down, really creating space in your life for yourself. Because I don't think we do it enough. We don't know how to sit with ourselves and our thoughts and our feelings and we either feel it and we want to like, uh, you know, um, or we distract and we want to be busy.

So I think that's, that's a huge, um, a huge part, you know, and I think that's being able to do that. I think will clear, clear your mind and really allow you to see. Kind of what who you are what what you need and what you're looking for. I think that's like at least the starting point for sure Awesome.

Well, we've hit our end of this episode and this was so great. Hopefully everyone enjoyed it. Fun. Um, uh, Logan, thank you so much for joining and just chatting through just what we're experiencing here in LA in the dating phase. We could go on, we could literally talk for like, probably two hours, uh, about all this, but thank you so much, um, and we appreciate you being on here.

Thanks so much, Beatrice. Have a good day. Thanks.